Windy Sydney

November 29, 2008 at 3:32 AM

Sexist much?

Entirely and constantly - so entirely that most of them don't even see it.

November 29, 2008 at 8:33 AM

You are right, they don't notice at all. It's just how it is and they don't question it.

It's so messed up.

November 29, 2008 at 11:53 AM

when i grew up mormon, i never noticed that either. recently my partner was asking me what mormon church is like, and she couldn't believe the men/women are separated. she thought it was really weird. it wasnt after seeing her reaction, that i realized it is, indeed, a bit odd! I guess the men need to be separated to lean how much power/opportunity they have, and the women need to learn how to be quiet wives and babymakers. ;) jk

November 29, 2008 at 1:22 PM

Thank you for the comment anonymous!

Women don't have any power at all in the church, and when they claim otherwise they are kidding themselves.

We don't have the opportunity to become church leaders, we don't have the super-duper-powers of the priesthood, yet we are supposed to feel like equals?

What a load of crap.

December 1, 2008 at 8:56 AM

I can see how separating them for different classes is strange. But if it's like a special come-if-you-want-to Wednesday night bible study for women, I think it's a little different. Because, men and women are different and relate to things or learn differently sometimes. That's the only reason. I don't think God values one sex over the other.

December 1, 2008 at 6:15 PM

It's more than just a bit blind and naïve to think that's the only reason (or even a reasonable reason) to separate men and women.

The church boasts the largest women's organisation in the world, but have women got a choice as too whether the want to be in the Relief Society? No. Like everything in the church, strict roles are forced on everyone with very little room for individuality or individual choice.

The lessons are supposed to be the same (as far as I know), so I don't see any good reason to keep men and women separated. God may not value one sex (or gender) over another, but it is overly clear that the Mormon church does.

December 2, 2008 at 8:12 PM

Well...If God wanted man and women to fulfill the same role then would there be gender at all? Men don't bear children and as a whole women cannot compete with men when it comes to physical strength. Men and women having different roles in life is how it is, our physical nature shows that.

Men and women have differences. Women don't need to hear about controlling sexual desires as much as men. Men don't have problems with gossip as much as women. Because of the different natures of men and women different topics need to be addressed more frequently. People also will relate better with those of their own gender, i would imagine this would better help people to learn.

Now that I have established why I think there are different classes for men and women let me ask you this question. Why is it that when there is a separation between men and women you conclude that it is meant to make women inferior? Lets take the separation from another angle.

The LDS church has a hard time treating women and men as equals. They teach that women don't need to work, they can just marry and burden a man to make money. Men are told from when they are a child that they will need to go out and work hard so his wife can stay home and not worry about work, but the stress doesn't end there. The man is burdened with the responsibility of the priesthood. When they receive this priesthood are held to a higher standard and their sins are faced with greater condemnation, and the stress doesn't end their. Upon receiving the priesthood they are also expected to take on more responsibilities like home teaching, priesthood meetings, and callings that take away what precious time he may have left after his job takes most of his time.


See what I did there, I ignored the big picture and pulled out what tidbits I wanted in order to make an argument. With more time I probably could have pulled some quotes from leaders and examples of men who are pushed to the edge to back up my case.

Yes the LDS church teaches that men and women serve different roles, but they also teach that man nor woman is superior to the other.

December 3, 2008 at 4:53 PM

James, you are so caught up that you refuse to see the obvious. Sorry.

December 3, 2008 at 4:57 PM

Here's the thing James, you're whole comment is riddled with sexism, and you don't even see it.

There are differences between men and women, yes, but they're not nearly do great as you seem to think. The funny thing (and sad) is that in your attempt at irony you made it clear that Mormonism *IS* sexist, and all those things you pointed are legitimate concerns that we have with the church, among many others.

The explicit teaching is that men are better than women - everything in the church screams that. The extremely rigid gender roles are totally artificial and lots of research into that has shown that rigid gender roles are almost universally negative and detrimental to mental health and healthy relationships.

Men have all the power in the church and women are relegated to "traditional" subservient roles in every respect. The Mormon church tries to undo women's liberation as much as it can, as is evidenced, among many things, by it's ardent opposition of the ERA.

It's sad that you cannot see how sexist Mormonism is, and that you try to defend it.

December 3, 2008 at 4:59 PM

Wow Craig,

You have done it again. You have climbed into my brain and expressed my thoughts clearly and effortlessly. Good grief, you should be a speech writer!

Andee

December 3, 2008 at 5:04 PM

LOL, yeah, it's a little squishy in there, but fun.

We just seem to think similarly.

December 3, 2008 at 8:15 PM

In the mind set that God did create man and women. If God wanted men and women to have the same responsibilities why would he create two genders that fill two roles if he could simply make a single gender that is capable of making offspring with that single gender?

Men and women can fulfill different roles be considered equal. Call it sexist if you want but keep in mind that the role separation is not meant to distinct any form of superiority.

December 3, 2008 at 8:50 PM

James,

You really don't see it, do you? Wow, I mean... it's right THERE in front of you.

Responsibilities have nothing to do with the reproduction of a species of people. In order for children to be born, there needs to be help from a man and a woman.

I really believe that men and women are equal, and that just because they are different physically they shouldn't be put into a box because of their physical nature. You, on the other hand, assume that since man and woman are different, that God would want man to have all the perks and the women to be background noise.

What in the name of God is so equal about men being allowed to rule the whole damn church and women being stuck in the background unable to make decisions? There are no women bishops, no women stake presidents, and there is no way a woman will be a prophet. Why?

Your argument makes Zero sense.

In the church, men are obviously superior in that they get to make all the decisions, they get the power of the priesthood (not that that power really exists, trust me) and they get to be the head of the household. Even Gordon B. Hinkley made a comment that "Women are men's most prized POSSESSIONS."

To think that God created man to be in charge and women to stand back is just asinine.

December 4, 2008 at 8:22 PM

Ramen Andee, ramen.