A Real Man of God!To the average Mormon reader:
If a man came up to you and told you that he had visitors from Heaven that told him of a new church he needed to start, would you believe him?
Or...
Would you roll your eyes and give the man a look of pity because he is obviously missing from the psychiatric center?
Would you assume that the man claiming to be a prophet of God was honest and full of good intentions?
Would you not check the man out and see if there was anything shady in his past before you put your heart and soul into following him?
I certainly hope that most of the people out there would think twice about following a man like this.
Why then, should we assume Joseph Smith is everything the church portrays him to be? Why shouldn't we check things out (even things that are not "faith promoting")? Why shouldn't we ask questions and be vigilant about truth and honesty?
If you "know" Joseph Smith is was a prophet of God because you prayed and got a special feeling even though there is evidence to the contrary, why don't you take the time to pray about other people who claim to be prophets of God?
It is my belief that many people trust Joseph Smith because they were taught to trust Joseph Smith. They, like me, were taught stories about how good, honest, wholesome and honorable he was. They were only given half of the story, though.
It's the same reason so many people trust that Warren Jeffs is a prophet of God, or that other cult leaders are prophets.
How do you know that your special feeling is right and the other peoples' special feelings are wrong?
You don't!
Andee
February 16, 2009 at 12:45 AM
Maybe I like what the prophet in question is selling.
In which case it's really kind of irrelevant what he's like at home.
February 16, 2009 at 6:05 PM
If you like what he is selling (answers) then you WANT to believe him and ask no questions? Shouldn't you look into the person you are putting your entire faith into?
You think it's irrelevant what he's like at home?
Interesting.
I couldn't disagree with you more.
It matters very much how a "prophet of God" treats others, especially his wife(s).
It should matter.
February 16, 2009 at 6:31 PM
yes it should matter (in reference to Seth). If a prophet is called from God, shouldn't he have "Christ-like" attributes in his everyday life?? If he is an asshole in his homelife and puts on a mask when he is "outside", what does that say about him?
If a "prophet" treats others like crap, that says a lot about how false he is. Can't even live by his own gospel.
February 16, 2009 at 7:21 PM
Why?
If I like the teachings, I like the teachings. I go by the message, not the messenger.
Seems simple enough.
February 16, 2009 at 9:43 PM
Seth, you just won't go away, will you?
Of course you like what he is selling. You would like to have a 14 year old girl in your bed too. Which, in his day, was the physiological equivalent of a 9 year old. 14? 9? Either way, you are perverse, Seth.
February 16, 2009 at 9:47 PM
Andee, Seth jumps around visiting many sites and creating conflict. He loves it. He just lives for this crap. He no more believes it than you or I. I finally figured this out.
He loves a good fight and that is the depth and breadth of it.
February 17, 2009 at 10:41 AM
Oh, no worries.
I am well aware of who Seth is...
He has made his presence known on this blog as well as many others. He comes across as an arrogant ass most of the time, and I rarely read everything he has to say.
When people do what he does (hop from one ex-Mormon blog to another causing conflict) it says more about them than it does about you.
Andee
February 17, 2009 at 12:03 PM
Look, if you'd like me to go away, I will honor your wishes.
Seriously, if this blog is just meant to be a therapeutic venting session where like-minded folks get together and share their frustrations, and the opposing camp isn't really welcome, fine by me. I'll buzz-off if you want. Group-support is a perfectly valid use of a website.
Would you rather I just went away?
February 17, 2009 at 12:08 PM
And Maybe,
I do believe in the Mormon faith. As I explained to you elsewhere. I just don't believe in it in a way you are used to.
I'd thank you not to go around misrepresenting what I've actually said.
And feel free to link to the conversation where you feel I've "admitted" to not believing in this whole "Mormon thing." That way people can judge for themselves whether I'm full of crap rather than just taking your word for it.
February 17, 2009 at 2:40 PM
Seth, you are always welcome here. Everyone is. If I didn't want you here or if I didn't welcome all sides of arguments I would never publish your comments.
I don't agree with the things you believe, and I can't understand how Joseph Smith marrying two 14 year old girls behind his own wife's back doesn't upset you. I don't understand how the racism in church doctrine doesn't upset you.
I will never understand. As I have said many times before, it's beyond me. Those things were not from God, and a loving deity would choose a prophet with more moral character.
Just sayin.
Toodles.
February 17, 2009 at 3:36 PM
Seth,
I never said YOU said you don't believe it. That is my opinion. What I think is that you enjoy making people squirm with your way over-the-top statements. You can give yourself any label you want. But you are not a Mormon as that religion has chosen to define itself.
And that's okay. Now that I have realized that and accept it, it is actually less frustrating. But you might want to take a look in the mirror and see that you do come across as an arrogant protagonist bully.
But it's Andee's blog, not mine. And I think most folks, especially Andee and Mike do a good job keeping you in line.
February 17, 2009 at 3:37 PM
Seth,
I never said YOU said you don't believe it. That is my opinion. What I think is that you enjoy making people squirm with your way over-the-top statements. You can give yourself any label you want. But you are not a Mormon as that religion has chosen to define itself.
And that's okay. Now that I have realized that and accept it, it is actually less frustrating. But you might want to take a look in the mirror and see that you do come across as an arrogant protagonist bully.
But it's Andee's blog, not mine. And I think most folks, especially Andee and Mike do a good job keeping you in line.
February 17, 2009 at 5:46 PM
I never said that stuff didn't bug me.
But look at it this way -
What am I supposed to do with all the many, many things I do like about this religion?
February 17, 2009 at 7:32 PM
I think we've dealt with the question of whether he slept with the two 14 year old girls at all in a previous post lonnnnggg ago. There is no evidence to suggest the contrary at this stage. My guess is yes. Second, what makes them 9 year olds? Hardly a correct distinction.
Regardless, I have my own personal views on polygamy which conflict with others quite starkly. Simply put, I think that whilst instituted and commanded, Smith got a few of the decisions he made wrong. McConkie relayed many times that as prophets and apostles, they were left to make their own decisions many times. I can't help but feel that Smith did the same thing here.
Its just the classic Prophet/deity approach where past prophets are akin to God in that they can never do nor did they ever do anything contrary to what God wanted.
Clearly not the case if we go through the Old Testament and the New Testament and the Churches history.
February 18, 2009 at 6:51 AM
I'm a prophet. An angel spoke to me one day when I took a blow to the head and told me all about God. I say that any articles of the Mormon faith that are worth a shit were stolen from my teachings and the rest were made up by corrupted agents of Satan who went on to create LDS as a means of insurgency.
See how easy that was?
February 18, 2009 at 8:29 PM
Long live the insurgency!
February 18, 2009 at 10:38 PM
Yes. I do. I am now a Maelstromlite. Amen.
February 19, 2009 at 6:05 PM
God came to me in a dream last night.
She told me that there were no true churches on the face of the earth, and she told me to restore her one true church.
I have been asked by God to marry as many men as I possibly can. They will all be good looking and muscular. Don't worry, it's not something I would choose on my own. God wants me to do this. Just pray about it. You will see that I am right.
What's that? You didn't get the same answer I did? You are not praying with love in your heart. You are not fasting. You are not paying me 10% of your money. That is why the spirit is not with you.
Follow me.
February 22, 2009 at 12:03 AM
Hmmm Andee if this was an attempt to be an accurate satirist, you also have to put in the following...
'I have been asked by God to marry as many men as possible. Whilst some are good looking, there are also the old men with hair growing out their ears and chest muscles which now resemble bosoms....'
Lets not forget the whole story shall we? :)
February 22, 2009 at 5:57 PM
Okay, Nicko...
"God has instructed me to marry any living man with a working penis."
Better?
February 22, 2009 at 9:33 PM
haha...not quite, but its an interesting interpretation? Personally, if I were to convince people that polygamy were the go, I'm not sure I'd really be into the 'older' females...but I'm sure you see JS as being somewhat partial to all females regardless of age.
I don't see it that way at all.